The Fordjour Brothers' Money Story

Brenton: [00:01:00] All right, welcome to the New Money, New Problems podcast. If you listened to the episode where I talked about my parents’ money story, you'll remember that my mother is from Memphis. And I have a better relationship with the city now than I did when I was a child, but when I was a child, I hated going to Memphis. But the two things, aside from spending time with family that I did enjoy, one of them was a place called Coletta's Pizza. When we were leaving Memphis, we would go to Coletta's and get some pizza. So I enjoyed that. But also on Saturdays at some point we would get to go to the Fordjours house. And I love the Fordjour family, Doc Fordjour, Mrs. Fordjour, we always liked spending time with them. But my cousins and I, what we really liked about the Fordjour house was getting to hang out with the Fordjour brothers. So they are not old enough to be uncles, so they're like big brother types to me and we thought and think they were just the coolest people in the world. And I asked if they would join the [00:02:00] podcast to tell a little bit about their story. They agreed. So we have Ike and Ricky, they can give their formal names when they introduce themselves, but we have Ike and Ricky Fordjour to tell their money story. Guys, thank you and welcome to the podcast. Ricky: Hey, Ike: up, man? It's good be Ricky: be here. Ike: And look, man, at my age, I'm glad you're not calling me uncle, so you're good. I appreciate that. Yeah, Brenton: Well, I'm excited to, , to hear you all share if you could give how you would like to be called. If not, Ike and Ricky, tell me what you do, , and then we'll get into some more about your story. Ricky: So I'm, I'm, I'm Richard Fordjour. I'm the youngest of the Fordjour brothers. , I live in Washington, D. C. , I'm married to a beautiful wife, Skyler, here. I got two kids and, and one on the way, actually. so, , yeah, and I'm, we're, I'm a dentist. I should say that. general dentist working in downtown D. C. Brenton: That was also a surprise that he dropped to me. Live on the Ricky: Ah, Brenton: So congratulations.[00:03:00] Ike: yeah, yeah. was a surprise to him, too. ... Ricky: yeah, yeah, man, Ike: yeah. So, , you know, people, I know who, , how I'm related to people based on what they call me, right? All my, my folks from home and people, , that I know really well all know me as Ike, because that means they probably know my dad too, who's also Isaac. But I can always tell you, you always know when I'm in my work professional environment when I go by Isaac. So for the case, since this is just us having family talk and no one else is going to see this, just call me Ike. , I'm the oldest of the Fordjour brothers. , I live right outside of Washington, DC. I work in government relations, , business. , you know, that's a euphemism for being a lobbyist. , and I've been so for, , for many years, , since I've been here. Been married, just celebrated 20 years, , of, , being married. And I have two beautiful young children, 16-year-old, , Isaac. , and 13-year-old Olivia. Brenton: Beautiful, beautiful. Well, we talked [00:04:00] about the fact that you are in Memphis, but you all have a unique story in terms of your parents and how they got to the city. Ike, you're aware that there's a, a play Ike that's running around Nashville, Isaac Adai, who, who I had podcast a few weeks ago, , and many people, say that you all look alike. I don't think you look alike at all, but you happen to Ghanaian. So if you could tell me a little bit about your family's journey to Memphis. Ike: Yeah, so, , first of all, Ike Addae, that's, that's my man. If there's anybody who's gonna be, , rolling around like me, that's who I wanna do it. He's, that's a solid brother. Um, my family, , my dad first came to this country in the early 60s, uh, from Ghana. , , a town called, , Hencrow, , and he came to this country, , in the early sixties and landed in Huntsville, Alabama. So if you can imagine, , coming to. The states in the early 60s, , and finding yourself in the middle of all of the [00:05:00] unrest that is Huntsville, Alabama, , that's where my dad, , his experience here in this country began. , and from there, he, , you know, Went to a couple of different places, but finally ended up in Memphis, Tennessee, , right, , shortly after the assassination of, of Dr. King, , where he, , came to study medicine whilst, , or oral surgery. He's an oral surgeon and was actually the first. Black person to go through that program, , at the University of Tennessee. So, that's how we ended up there. My dad, you know, came, finished school and then started a private practice there. And, then we all came along. Brenton: Okay. When I talk to I, uh, about the experience of growing up in the area and what era in which you grew up in the area, because he's from the South as well. He talks about this like duality of cultures, at school, the culture is like this. And then at home, I have a very strong Ghanaian culture, which is different in terms of its customs, its expectations. Is that something you all [00:06:00] experienced as well? Ricky: Oh man, no, no doubt, , yeah, , I, I often joke and say that the outside of my, my house was, was obviously Memphis, but the inside was... A village in Ghana, , because at any point you can come in smelling some stew cooking and also, , hearing my mom go off on us for being for disobeying. , so it was, it was, it was a, it was a thing that you did. I mean, a lot like. , people, we go by African American, right? , I always say that we're, we actually do represent the dash, right? We have, we can experience, we've, we've experienced it from both sides and in the South at that time, when we were growing up, you know, late eighties, , to nineties. , there weren't that many Africans around, so we were easy targets, , and we, we learned at early ages, I think, how to blend in at school and in the public, , so as not to be that target, but also we knew how to come [00:07:00] home and, , Not bring some of those, , characteristics that we learn outside of the house into the house. Cause you know, mom and dad weren't having that. , I remember, , quick, really, really quick story. My brother, Derek, who's not on here, , decided he was going to put a little kit in his hair at the time. You know, this was a hot thing, people giving little quick Jerry curl action. , so he did it. And , he was, he was the man at school for a day. Then when he got home, it took about 10 minutes for my mom and dad to decide that was it, he was going to go bald. So things like that, , you, you learn to satisfy both sides of yourself. , and there, there's pluses and minuses to that. And some of that, I would say that I'm still adjusting to, but I'd say overall, it makes your path a little easier, , just because you're, you're a little bit stronger, I think, in a lot of aspects. Ike: Yeah, you know, there was, there was no doubt, [00:08:00] coming up that we were Ghanaian first. First and foremost, period, dot. , neither one of us, , actually had the opportunity to visit the continent until we were adults. , but our parents, we'd never heard our parents speak to each other in English. , all the cultures, , everything, you know, they, they put, they put it in us deep, deep, deep inside of us. , but at the same time, they taught us how to assimilate, , how to, you know, how, I think we were, we learned how to code switch probably like no others because they did not want us to always, while they, while we knew we were different. And they taught us to be different. And the, the, the center of our identity is different. They didn't want us to be so different, , that we couldn't compete. They didn't want us to be so different that we couldn't participate, that we would be outliers, , you know, with the rest of the community. So, , Rick, you said it well, I have, I'm going to have. The bar that we really live the dash of being African and American is one thing being African and American, you know, in some parts of America, but we were African and American in [00:09:00] Memphis, right? , in the, in the deep, deep South and, , people, you know, it was tough. You know, people were, people were not kind, , you know, to folks who had a, , who had a, a long name that, that many people couldn't pronounce. , our Ricky: Hey, it is also how we probably developed our senses of humor, too, because that our Ike: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. If you didn't have thick skin. Yeah. And then, you know, we had a mother who had, , you know, my mother and father, you know, both maintain their ass, , their accents. Where's her accent as a, as a, you know, that is a part of pride. She is never going to lose that. and, and so, you know, people would, would, would tease us and all, but it was, it was a, a, a point of pride for us in a point of, you know, what our identity really was, so, Brenton: For me, my entire life, I can't think of a time when I didn't know your parents, obviously. But I'm just now finding out that he was the first to go through his program. So, he and she had to learn [00:10:00] that assimilation first to teach you all. Have you ever talked to them about what it was like to do that with no guide? Ricky: You know, I would say what probably ended up happening for them is that they ended up turning deeper into their, their religion or our religion. They're Ghanaian first, they're Seventh Day Adventists next. And I think that a lot of the relationships that they formed as a young couple, a young immigrant couple, couple in, , in our home church, Longview Heights Seventh day Adventist Church, they ended up forging some lifelong relationships with people, , because they had to lean on something. And I think that, that made... Our religious experience growing up, what it was because of those deep roots. So, Ike: Rick, you're Rick. You're so right. It you, you know, it was the church where, where our family experienced community, they had been Seventh Day Adventist in Ghana. They had been Seventh Day Adventist, you know, when they [00:11:00] came to the States and when they came to Memphis with all the challenges that they faced. It was the church, it was Longview Heights where they were able to, to find community. And there were people that we went to church with, Mama Brown, Mama Branch, you know, those folks. And it was Brenton, your family, you know, , the Wilson family who were our babysitters, who you talk about cool. That's, you know, that's where we learned everything that we learned. And so that community that we got from the church. , is, is really, , what, what anchored them in that, in, in the Memphis area. Brenton: So, tell me about what the process was like going through college, picking your respective careers, especially since you chose to not go to, , into oral surgery. What was it like when you started to? And now it's up to you to hold those standards up. Ike: Well, I'm still trying to build a name for myself. So, , , you know, it's, it's a work in progress. Look, look, coming up, my parents dream was that you're going to be [00:12:00] a doctor, you're going to be a lawyer. Any, you talk to any African family, they're going to tell you it's all the same thing for all of us. It's about the scientists and the sciences and all. And I remember going to college, , and when I first went to school, I was an engineering major. And so, if anyone knows me and my relationship to math, you know, that's the biggest joke in the world, right? There's no way, there's no way I could be an engineering major. , and so I went to my dad and told him that I wanted to major in political science and, and my uncle Amos, you know, his, his, you know, sort of his friends, and I talked about wanting to major in political science and he was not supportive. At all, he was like, what are you going to, what are you going to do with that? You're going to be a political scientist? Like, what do you, what do you do with that? , but I knew from an early age, this was something that I was interested in. And, and I understood, I understand now that their inability to, his inability to support me in that, , was because he didn't really understand it, right? This is another thing that we talk about assimilation and all, and this was, this was foreign to [00:13:00] him. , and so I struggled, right? . I struggle finding my place, , in school. I spent more time doing those things that I did understand, you know, doing things in the community, doing, you know, , you know, being very social, , building and like you said, building a name for myself with, with, with touching on, , a lot of things that I knew translated, , outside of the classroom, but I really struggled with that for a long time. It wasn't until I was an adult really and moved to Washington, D. C. that I found something that made My degree, my, my major in political science makes sense. , and I think I had to be 30 something, I think, before my dad finally understood, you know, what, what it was that I do, you know, if he understands now, I don't really know if he understands now, but. Brenton: I'll dig into that a little more, Ricky. So, you hear Ike say. It was in my 30s when I started to establish myself, what this, you know, profession has for me. From the outside looking in, [00:14:00] we're in Nashville or visiting Memphis and we're saying, Ike's working on this political campaign, Ike's doing this, Ike's doing that. You never know that those were the things that he's dealing with internally. As the, the, baby, maybe you're not feeling that academic pressure from your parents, but around that time, are you starting to look at the talents of your brothers and feeling any pressure in that regard? Ricky: I think, I think yes. , but again, the pressure was never, what am I going to do that's going to top them? It was never that. It was just like, I guess I got to stop being lazy. You know, here goes Ike winning another award or, you know, Derek getting this scholarship. I guess I gotta, you know, that because as he said, that baseline is success, right? So, it keeps, it keeps moving up. , I, I would say that I was definitely not a strong student. I, and I think, this, this blessing that we're talking about. was also my curse, [00:15:00] which was because I didn't feel the pressure, I didn't feel pressure, right? So, , my, I think my personality is just one that's very laid back, , very chill, a little stoic. So, I'd say that's, that was probably my, my blessing and curse. story. [00:16:00] Brenton: well, you know, this podcast is about money. So I want to ask you all, as you are navigating this childhood experience, Do you recall the first time that you recognized money? Ike: I think we always knew. well, I, you know, Rick, Rick and I have, you know, what, seven years between us. , and when I was coming up, Was probably more the struggle years, , when my dad, was, was, you know, leaving school, setting up a practice that was setting up a, you know, his oral surgery [00:17:00] practice, , in a community where he wanted to serve the underserved. And so watching that struggle of setting that business up and the sacrifices that we had to make at home, when everyone had this perception that your dad is a doctor, people make assumptions for what that means, but that's not the life that we lived, , every day at home. My mom made the sacrifice of staying home with us to raise us, so she was not in the workplace. , in addition to what my dad was doing, , to advance his practice, he was also very involved with taking care of folks back home, right? He came to America, but he had a whole village, , back home that he was, that he was taking care of. My mom. Have a whole village back home that she was taking care of. There were a lot of expectations on them. And so I understood money to be something that, you know, we worked for as a means to the end, but it wasn't the end. Right? , it was what money could do for the people. That needed it, right? Us getting our needs met, [00:18:00] us being able to provide for the folks who, who needed it otherwise, and having to sacrifice and not have certain things that you may have thought you wanted, , for the greater good and not just for what was happening in our house. Ricky: man, I'm going to jump right on that because, , I mean, so, so well said, like, because I remember feeling like angry as a child, You know, I would see these big packages or cars being bought or whatever back home in Ghana, , and yet I can't go on the school field trip or whatever that I wanted to go to, you know, and, and I don't want to, want to, by any means, try to represent ourselves as if we were struggling, you know, I think for the average family, , middle, middle class family, we were doing pretty, pretty good. , but, you know. Still feeling like you, and remember, our parents are African, , so this is not us being spoiled brats wanting to be able to do more. Okay? This is baseline stuff we're [00:19:00] talking about. , I have to clarify that. , but you know, I remember being angry and then maybe maturing to the point that I understood it, right? Because maybe by then I had actually had cousins or uncles, or somebody come at me. Here and I saw how much they didn't have or, you know, I was able to hear a story about how the living conditions were around the people that we were helping. But then I remember reaching another point, of being confused about why people of our same status seemed to be able to do more than we were doing. That was very confusing. So I think my relationship with money started. Being formed right there. And I would say it wasn't even about money. It was more about career choices because at that point, that stage in life, I think I associated money, riches or wealth with career choices, which is a mistake. Brenton: I believe it is extremely common For children of [00:20:00] first generation high income earners, and I'm one of those, to have the moment you're describing where, well really two moments, Ricky, you described one when you're looking at everyone else and you're saying, Well, if, if you work at the same place that this guy works or this woman works, like what, what's the difference here? And in our house, wasn't that we didn't have those things, because my dad would still buy those things, to my mother's chagrin. It was, they bought it and they don't seem stressed. Like, y'all bought it, and my parents are arguing about this at home, Ricky: Yeah. Yeah, right. Brenton: there's something going on here where you shouldn't have bought that, right? And there is, uh, oh man, my little guy has Ike: Oh man, what's Ricky: Hey, what's up, Brenton: for those who watch online. The second part, alright, gonna sit up here, you gotta be quiet, okay? Alright, the second part of that... , Ike, you mentioned that you, remember there being [00:21:00] times when. There's an assumption being made about you as a person or your family, right? It's not even just what you're dealing with internally. It is, okay, people think that we're a physician family or a surgeon's family. So that means X, Y, Z about my parents or about us. And I remember a conversation with my sister where I said, you know, I guess to me, I don't really care if someone says, oh, y y'all are Richie, rich. Y'all do X, Y, Z. 'cause maybe we do . You know, that's not the issue. My issue is when you then assume something about my work ethic or my character. Because I can tell you, I truly believe, as I dig back into why I do what I do, that a part of that is me trying to prove to those people, you know, I can be helpful. I can work hard. I can be of value above and beyond what my parents gave me. Ricky: Yeah, I think dude, I think we shared the exact same feelings and emotions. , you [00:22:00] know, I remember really dumbing down. The things that we did or the things that we had, which again, were pretty basic. And we were definitely the family that did not see money or value, didn't value people that way at all, but you would have this tension with this person that you, you feel a true connection with, but they're having ill feelings towards you just because of the neighborhood you live in. But you know, that was something that I think it made me a little bit more introverted. Then I probably would have been, because I just didn't want people getting close. I'd hate it when anybody came to my house. I didn't want anybody coming to my house. , you know, at one point, man, my, my parents, they'll probably kill me if they knew I said this one point we owned a Jaguar, which at the time was pretty hot. I mean. Sexy Black Jaguar, right? And a lot of people don't know this, but at the [00:23:00] time, my dad had made a decision. We're going to have one car for a little bit, right? We're going to get rid of this other car. No, we don't have one car. But when they would pull up within that Jag that I know was the only thing we had to lug three kids to three different places. And, you know, my mom had to drop my dad off at his dental practice. And he's trying to act like he just parked out in the garage, Crazy stuff. But when, when they pulled up to pick us up in the Jag, the hate started right away. And I remember always just wanting to be like, nah, y'all don't understand, ? So, so I think for me, that started this thing that I still struggle with today of, money being associated with negativity. So I, I never really wanted to appear like I had anything. You know, I don't think being flashy is in me, but even some of the subtle flash, like I'm, I'm always trying to dumb it down, right? And I think it comes [00:24:00] from those early childhood experiences. Brenton: Can you tell me something about your experience with money as a child that you believe you've brought with you into adulthood? In terms of, I see the residue of that now in my adult years. Ike: I can see so many similarities. , have, I've, you know, I have a friend who, , you know, joke that I just don't seem to be motivated by money. I'm not motivated by money because I believe that, If I work hard and I'm chasing my passion and I do what I'm supposed to do and I'm investing back in my community and I'm not holding everything close to myself, I'm going to be all right. My needs are going to be met. If I've got that baseline of my needs met, if I'm giving to others, I'm going to give something back to myself. It may not be a village in Africa that I'm taking care of, but it could be, you know, something that I'm investing in in my community back home in Memphis. , it could be something that, . You know, someone that I'm taking into my, someone that I'm taking into my home the [00:25:00] same way that I saw my parents bring someone always, you know, living in our home. , so I think that's what, that's what I, I really, , you know, carry with me today for good and for bad, right? , sometimes I struggle with what that balance is, right? And prioritizing my own interests. And I don't want to, I don't want to make it like I don't like money. Cause I love money because I grew up looking at your dad his suits and I like how, you know, You know, I, I, I, I know, I know who I learned that from, , and I have the same struggles in my house, that he may had coming up, but I do understand the power of money to do good, not just the power of money just to hold on to and just do things for yourself. Ricky: Yeah, , I think in a couple ways, one of them I've sort of touched on already, and that is, shying away from money, , shying away from money opportunities I should say. , and it's funny because as a kid, I remember not wanting to be the privileged kid or not wanting to be the kid who appeared to have it. So, [00:26:00] oftentimes now, in, professional life or even personal life where there's opportunities, , I'm not saying I'm shying, I'm purposely shying away from them, but I realize that I'm not as motivated as I should be. , for that, , I think another one is, , my parents were very benevolent as, as we've, we've mentioned already, not only going back home to Ghana, but in our community and. You know, as, as, as short or small of a circle as, as just within our church. So my mother would give and give and give and give and give. She still does to this day. And I find that I do that a lot. , and, and, you know, it's one thing to say, Oh, it's cool to be the person who's, you know, picking up the tab here and there, but even in my professional life, I think if there's, , an opportunity to step up and be generous or something, I'm the first to do it, , in a lot of ways that, don't make financial sense from a business Brenton: Been there as the child the adult. [00:27:00] I also find it common, just, there's so many commonalities in the experiences of any person in our community but first-generation high-income earners, second-generation high-income earners as we all are and in spite of a higher income than most, in my household financial literacy wasn't taught. And it wasn't because my parents didn't want to, it was because they didn't know it to teach. Was it the same in your household? Hehehehehehehehe Ike: today. Um, but, but, but I don't, I don't think in the, the way that we talk about financial literacy. No, it was not. I don't think it was taught in that way. Two things I'll point out. My dad was a serial entrepreneur. You know, he had his practice, but he had all kinds of businesses on the outside. He had a record label, he had a shoe company, the popcorn company, and on and on and on, where he was trying to do, , something else to supplement, , you know, [00:28:00] something that was, was, was, was really, , feeding his passion. And that was, that was one thing that we saw. Ricky: I'll pick up on that. , he also had a travel agency. He also had a telecommunications company. forgot about those, like, and I'm sure we're forgetting something else. But yeah, I think definitely there was no financial literacy, , and I think, you know, looking back, if I had to, if I could rewrite any part of this story or even give my parents advice in retrospect, , which I would never do. But it would be, be, honest about what you don't know. know, , I think we put so much into, , our father and mother, , respecting, you know, them as the source. And... If something seemed okay with them or for them, then it was definitely okay with or for us. But I think looking back, like it would have been okay to say, man, I messed [00:29:00] up or, you know, when this, when I shouldn't have opened this business, when I did, , look at all, you know, just, just being a little more transparent, I think would have. I'd like to believe would have helped. I mean, I definitely think that I'm trying to, you know, as parents, we always try to correct what we think was wrong. Right? And meanwhile, we're creating, you know, new, if not some of the same mistakes. But I know that for me, I want to be so transparent with my mistakes, with my failures now, just so my kids realize, hey, maybe you don't need to go down the same path I went down. You know, things like that, that I think are, don't require you to be financially literate. It just requires you to be transparent. Brenton: What are some of the positives in terms of how you deal with money now that came from what you saw from your parents? Ike: man. , I think, , you know, I, I could say the exact same things that you just [00:30:00] said. , my, we grew up in a household that was, was based, based on faith, right? And my parents, we always have faith, that what we needed was going to be provided, but, but, you know, faith without works is dead, right? And so I learned that, you know, I've got to work. I've got to put in the work. I've got to show up and that I can do what I love. Right? My father does what he loves. My mother, you know, does what she loves, which is taking care of people. Today, I'm doing what I If you would have shown me this career, When I was eight years old, I'm doing exactly what it was I would have wanted to do. And it's a blessing to be able to do that because on the path to getting there, there wasn't money along the pathway to getting there. Money came later, but I had the confidence that if I was doing what it was, I believed in, that I wanted to do, that was, that I felt I was called to do, that the money, that the money would, would come later. And because I [00:31:00] wasn't motivated by just the money piece of it, I could have the faith. That when I put in the works, I would get to where I needed to be. Ricky: Yeah. I, I think for me, , it would be that my parents, I always saw them, no matter what level, , of comfort we were living at the time or discomfort we were living at the time, they always made. Took what they had. And as we all, you know, in our community, we, we all know this, but they took what they had and always made it the most elite that they could. Right. So if it was, , you know, something that was, if my, if my dad only had two suits, you know, he was going to keep those suits clean and he was going to make sure they were crisp and he was gonna, you know, make sure the accents were, were nice and throw them off with it. So I definitely learned that from my parents, , some of the struggles that, you know, we knew were going on. , we never showed that, they never [00:32:00] showed that and they trained us really to do that. So I think now I'm learning that, you know, life has peaks and valleys. , definitely financial peaks and valleys and during those valley times, you know, you still have to act, act as if you live in the peak. So, that's, that's probably what I've gotten that I hope I continue to carry throughout life. Brenton: Ike, before you hopped on Ricky and I were talking and I was sharing that I think that even if it's not the case now, as we progress into the future, every single industry, a part of what makes you viable in the marketplace will be your public profile. Who do know? Who knows you? What is people's opinion of what you do based on what they can find in the community or online? And I also shared with him that even before it was an online thing, that was something that I saw in you. I'm like, man, Ike knows everybody. You know, I'm not going to name drop, but like, you [00:33:00] don't just people, you know, people, and you know, people who a lot of other people know. Ike: Mm hmm. Brenton: I believe that that is a characteristic because when you are looking for a new opportunity or evaluating a new opportunity, and they're looking at you and they can say, if this person is representing us, people will be aware of what we're doing as a company. And that has value. Was intentional? Is that just who you are? Have you developed it intentionally? Ike: Man, that is, that's, that's just who, that's just who I am. It's the, it's the home that I grew up in. We used to joke about Thanksgiving at our home. You show up for Thanksgiving dinner and there were seven people sitting at the table that make, you know, that make no sense at all. Like, how did my mom put this band of misfit toys together? , but that's what brings me joy, man. And, you know, you never make friends because you need a friend. You make friends because you're doing the right thing, man. And it was never intentional. It's [00:34:00] still not intentional. It's only when I hear it back like this that I really think about it. But that's, that's who I am. That's what I saw. And you meet some people along the way when you're doing, when you're doing good things and that's what keeps me going. I have more friends than I have money. , and it's easier to make friends than it is to make money. So Brenton: Well, when you leave, you know, you don't get to take the money with you, but at least your friends will well of you. Ike: Yeah. I hope so. Well, you will. Thank you, brother. Brenton: Well, Ricky, now, now it's your term to me. I, I talked about what I, and Ike, I don't mean to imply any way that, in any way that you are not likable. But in terms of just the first thing that comes to mind, with you Ricky, is likability. There are, there are some people where if someone said, “I can’t stand that guy because they did X, Y, and Z to me, you'd believe it. And then there are other people like you, where it's like, I can't stand Ricky. If somebody said that I'd be like, man, well, what's wrong with you? Cause like the thing that you're describing, I just don't see it playing out that way. what what is [00:35:00] it that allowed you to develop that and has it served you professionally? Ricky: yeah. So I would say, without a doubt, it's my family, man. They, you know, we're, we are a band of misfits and, you know, me being the last one there, I had to break up fights between this guy Derek. Every other, every other hour. , so, you know, I think just learning diplomacy at home and feeling comfortable or my most comfortable, , in that position. , I think probably started to develop as a child. And it's definitely helped in my profession. You know, I deal with people, probably 90 percent of people I see hate the dentist, and hate what I have to do for them. And it's made it easier to connect with people and not see it as a burden. So I'm very thankful to have those experiences. I have to say, before we end this, man, I know this is not in your notes, but I have to say, [00:36:00] your... Family is one of the families that my family loves the absolute most. , we, we in a lot of ways looked up to you guys. , just enjoyed all the time that we had. Your, you know, from your sister to all of the, , extended new members of your family that are there. We love them just the same. , I have to say your dad to me personally, and he knows this. I won't go too deep. , it had a huge influence on, on my just life choices and you know, I still think about him and a lot of decisions that, that I, I ponder. , and your mother, just the coolest, coolest woman that I remember, , knowing. , so I just wanted to say that, man. But I have to say, finally, I'm also a fan of this podcast, brother. Keep doing what you're doing. It's helpful to, , to many, and it's entertaining to everybody else. Brenton: appreciate those kind words. You all know I love you too. You also know because I view you all as [00:37:00] big brothers. I don't mind asking for favors like these, just like I said, I to piggyback on that next trip to Ghana. I'm going to bring it up again. Ike: on, come come on, come on. We're part of your family, you're part of ours. Come on, let's And man, good job, man. You, I, you talk about me, man. I keep hearing about, you know, every time I turn around, somebody's, somebody's with you, so I'm going to start coming to you for campaign contributions in a while. Brenton: I just, just hang out in parking lots and see who's walking inside. Just follow me.